More HDTV Questions

**Xtopia** · 05-02-2002

Hi guys, recently while browsing the forums, I have seen people say thing like "Ya, the game supports 1080i" or "My tv supports 780p" What are these numbers?!? and what does the "p" and "i" mean.
Also, I saw an HDTV a few days ago at a store. It had the best picture ever! I aked the guy about it, and he said the tv was hooked up to "Dish HDTV" in other words it was an HDTV signal. *If* I get an HDTV, well I get that same picture qualitity while play XBox games, and/or watching DVD's via the XBox. Please keep answers simple...I'm not a technology wiz! Thanks guys!

**l Maximus l** · 05-02-2002

Well, the "p" in 480p or 720p means "progressive scan".

Basically, what happens to your normal tube TV is that there are lines going across your TV really fast to produce the picture. Each line that is going across actually has a gap between it. So, if you are going from top to bottom, the image is like stripes going down and then the stripes are filled in with the rest of the picture.

However, with progressive scan, there are no scripes...the entire image is being produced all at once. Yes, they are still lines and in 480p there are 480 lines per second going up and down your screen to produce the image. Obviously, with 720p, or 720 lines, the lines are smaller, hence the clearer image!

To be dead honest, I have no idea what the "i" stands for in 1080i...but, I'm guessing that there are 1080 lines being produces, therefore, giving you the sharpest image possible!

Many DVD movies support 1080i if your HDTV is capable in producing it. It's like lookign through a window!!! However, XBox games are only formatted to 480p so far...I would expect that 2nd or 3rd generation XBox games will be 1080i and I can't wait!!!!!

Hope that helps!

**techie** · 05-02-2002

The i stands for interlaced. The way it works is all the odd numbered
lines are scanned first from top to bottom the on the next pass
the even numbered lines are scanned in the same manner.

So on each frame the picture in scanned (displayed) on the
tube or screen by the odd numbered lines first then again
by the even numbered lines. This is done so fast that normally
you do not notice things like flickering or picture jitter.

In progressive mode both the odd and even numbered lines
for each frame are displayed at the same time, giving the
picture a smoother appearence. The Xbox in progressive
scan mode is very smooth and clean, detail stands out more.

**MidniteArrow** · 05-02-2002

The i stands for "interlaced" the p for "progressive". The previous post explained a progressive scan picture. Your TV screen is made up of "lines" of resolution. Your TV manually draws all of these lines on the screen approximately 30 times per second. When you are displaying an interlaced picture, only 1/2 of these lines are drawn each time the picture is drawn to the screen: every other line to be specific. So the first time a picture is drawn, it draws lines 1,3,5,7,9,... and the next time it is drawn it draws lines 2,4,6,8,10,... and then repeats. With a progressive scan picture, it draws every line. While an interlaced picture has the same resolution as a progressive scan picture, you get some visual artifacts on the screen that are unwanted. A progressive picture is superior to an interlaced picture because of this.

1080i actually draws 540 lines of resolution each frame update. 720 p actually draws 720 each frame update. 720p looks the best, then 1080i, then 480p, then 480i. (There are some middle resolutions, but they are not very popular such as 525/60 which the Xbox dashboard uses if your TV supports it - 525/60 means 525 lines of resolution, progressively drawn, 60 times per second)

**MidniteArrow** · 05-02-2002

Basically, on this one, wait and watch the forums. There are several of us acting as test subjects on this one right now. There is only one title out currently that claims it supports the HD resolutions: Burnout by Acclaim. I have this title, but have yet to get it to work in 1080i (my TV does not support 720p).

When this feature fully kicks in and is used frequently, the graphics on the games will have the capability to be much better than they currently are. I wouldn't expect to see much of it for at least 6 months though.

As for DVDs, most DVDs output a 480p signal. I am not aware of the capability of a DVD to output a 1080i signal, but others have stated that it is possible. There are currently some HD broadcasts going over satellite (2 channels - HD Net and HBO), and a few networks are starting to broadcast in HD (CBS and Fox, but only in certain areas). For the networks, you'll need an Antenna and an HD receiver as the transmissions are over the air only. I would assume that eventually the cable companies will get up off their butts and start carrying HD transmissions, but since an HD transmission takes twice the bandwidth as that of a standard transmission, they'll wait until not doing it cuts into their profit margin or until some government agency makes them do it.

**techie** · 05-02-2002

Speaking of cable companies offering HD content:

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmp...atoday/4077770

**Xtopia** · 05-02-2002

Thanks for the help fellas! I have one more question:

I thought the XBox does not support proggressive scan. So does that mean that you can't watch DVD's with 720p???? In other words, the XBox cannot take advantage of HDTV, right? If that is the case...Im pis$ed!

**techie** · 05-02-2002

The Xbox does support progressive scan via the HD
connector to an HDTV for games only. It unfortunately
does not support progressive scan for DVD videos.

I remember reading somewhere that MS was considering
turning this on or adding it later to the Xbox. I think
they would have sold more units had progressive scan
for DVD video been implemented.

Also, even if progressive scan mode for DVD video had
been implemented, you would still only be able to view
them at their native 480p mode anyway. HD DVD is
coming that will support higher resolutions like 720p
or 1080i in the future, but probably not for another year
or two at the earliest.

**Xtopia** · 05-02-2002

The Xbox does support progressive scan via the HD

Uhhh...What is the HD?

**DBXNY** · 05-02-2002

Originally posted by Xtopia
Thanks for the help fellas! I have one more question:

I thought the XBox does not support proggressive scan. So does that mean that you can't watch DVD's with 720p???? In other words, the XBox cannot take advantage of HDTV, right? If that is the case...Im pis$ed!

The Xbox supports 1080i (HDTV), 720p, or 480p resolutions for games only (not DVD), but the game must be developed in 720p or 1080i for it to provide those resolutions. It actually has a progressive-scan conversion chip built inside for the capability to output all games in 480p however - thus all games support 480p. To use this output, you'll need a TV that can handle the higher scan rate. For the most part, this includes most digital televisions.

Note also, that all DVDs are 480i only with the capability of providing 480p with a progressive-scan player. The only way to get any HDTV resolution now is with HD broadcast, either via Over-the-air, Satellite, or Digital Cable. We won't see any 1080i or 720p DVDs until the possible proliferation of HD-DVD, but that won't be happening anytime soon.

Hope this helps.DB

**techie** · 05-02-2002

Sorry, the High Definition connector for the Xbox. This
uses component video cable (3 cables) to connect to
the component input on an HDTV, to give you the best
picture quality you can currently get from the Xbox.

Here is a link to a pretty good site that explains HDTV:

http://www.hdpictures.com/

**Xtopia** · 05-02-2002

First of all, all of you have helped tremendously! But I have another quesion. Okay, currently, I have just a regular 33 inch tube tv. Nothing fancy. What kind of resolutions is that giving me? it is an "i" right?
And also, techie, HD are wired right....you hook your XBox up to your tv...it is called the "High Definition Audio/Vidoe pack" right?

**techie** · 05-02-2002

yup!

**DZNUTZ** · 05-02-2002

ok first off..this is a KILLER THREAD (at least IMO becuase i to am considering buying a top model HDTV set)

i hope this link cont's...but i'll have to read it again tommorow morn (considering i'm semi intoxicated)

anyways...all the info is apreciated...and i have a few ?'s of my own since their seems to be folks in here that areknowledgable on this subject)...and i'm gonna start another thread.

its basically gonna be duplicate of one i made earlier( but more refined) ..but its a big ?..and big $$$ so i wanna make sho...

**DZNUTZ** · 05-02-2002

please foloow link if u could help me w/ projection HDTV's and their burn-in image problem.

http://www.xboxaddict.com/forums/sho...threadid=12443

thanx

**LynxFX** · 05-03-2002

Just one correction to the excellent info above.

No longer do all games support 480p like we thought they were supposed to. Nope, EA screwed up with 007 Agent Under Fire. During either the car sections or the FPS sections the game actually only will output 480i and then during the other it is back to 480p. This is all due to very ass poor programing on their part. There is no excuse for that, especially on the Xbox.

Otherwise, every other game supports 480p.

**Hugh_Jass** · 05-03-2002

If you're really concerned about the XBOX playing DVDs in progressive scan you can always buy a line-doubler for your HDTV. Hmmm...now that I think about it, some HDTVs have line-doublers built-in.

In short, I wouldn't worry about it too much. Progressive scan is fine, but it won't change your life. It's not nearly as dramatic as the difference between stereo and DD 5.1.

**MidniteArrow** · 05-03-2002

A line doubler, while great technology, is no substitute for the DVD player actually outputting a progressive scan signal. A line doubler is not going to create information. An interlaced picture only has the data contained in every other line in the transmission. A line doubler will use this information to fill in the gaps, but will not be as good as if every line of data had been in the original transmission (which was read off the DVD). There's no magic involved, if the DVD player does not output the data, there's no way for the line doubler to gain access to it.

As for the difference in quality, I can not even stand to watch an interlaced signal anymore. The visual artifacts are incredibly annoying to me, and the difference in the two is night and day. I've polled some of my usual house guests, and most of them can not tell the difference (which amazes me). I think the general population is so accustomed to an interlaced picture that they just ignore the visual artifacts it causes. Since I usually look at computer monitors (almost all computer video is now progressive scan, and has been for several years), my eyes are still sensitive to it.

It all depends on the person, but you should look at the two and make up your own mind.

**Xtopia** · 05-03-2002

Okay! Thanks guys! But once again...I have a question. This question sums up all my quesitons...and forgive me if you guys have answered it without me realizing it. Okay here it is:

As you know, I recently saw an HDTV hooked up to a HDTV signal! The picture was amazing! Now, If I buy an HDTV and hook my XBox up to the HDTV, will the picture quality be as incredible as a HDTV hooked up to an HDTV signal? This includes, DVD's and XBox games.